Trump Flight Delays in 2025; No Surprise Billing Act Two Years In

Jessie Naor (00:00)

All right, good morning. Welcome to the VIP seat. Today is January 9th and today's top stories in private aviation include how Starlink's Bizav competition is heating up and how Trump's inauguration means South Florida traffic delays for four more years. Your host today include yours truly, Jessie Naor, and our co-host today is Michael Farley. Michael, welcome to the show.

Michael Farley (00:20)

It's an honor, Jessie. Thank you for having me.

Jessie Naor (00:23)

Awesome. Well, folks, sit back, buckle up, and let's take

Alright, well everyone has been on the Starlink excitement gang, but GoGo and OneWeb, they're finally starting to launch their low earth orbit satellite services. I think we're all kind of excited to see something new to the market. We've all been excited for Starlink, but now it's nice to see some competition for the Starlink coming along as well. But something funny happened. The service was supposed to be turned on, I think it was the night of New Year's Eve, or January 1st or something.

and this was really giving me a 2000, 1999 vibes. They forgot to program that there are 366 days in 2024 because of the leap year and that delayed the launch of the service by two days, which was hilarious. But they did, they were able to fix it and now it seems like the service is up and running. I haven't heard from any customers yet, but my understanding is now that the Galileo service is official, on.

Michael Farley (01:22)

It's great to see the competition, as you said, to see the LEO networks and what that'll do for connectivity. It's kind of interesting, right? You have a room of rocket science space engineers. And if I was in that room, I don't know that I'd add too much value in all the problems that they have to solve. But days of the week and months of the year, I might be able to contribute there. I know the months of the year and the days of the year.

Jessie Naor (01:38)

Okay.

Thank you.

Michael Farley (01:46)

But anyways, I think it is funny. It's a little bit of a glitch, but it's good to see that they're competing. think they have a couple other problems on their hands, right? Getting up to speed with what Starlink is, moving from an HDX network to an FDX network, removing the latency and the buffers. so a little glitch at the beginning of the year. I think there's some big things to focus on to stay relevant here.

Jessie Naor (01:50)

you

Yeah, mean, they definitely, think GoGo has moved in the right direction. know, Air-to-Ground is, well, we saw Smart Sky go out of business. You know, I think this...

LEO satellite service is obviously where the future is kind of headed and what people are excited about. So think it's very smart that they did this partnership with OneWeb. But yeah, mean, some of the speeds, you know, it's not completely Starlink adjacent yet. You know, the HDX system is a little lower bandwidth, not bandwidth, but lower speed. I think maximum speeds of 60 megabit per second downloads, while what you were saying, the FDX system that they're supposed to launch in Q2 of this year.

can be almost up to 200 megabits per second. So that'd be the super fast Starlink kind of experience. But hey, I'm glad to see something, because I think Starlink is great, but also people have complained that, hey, it's not really the same kind of customer support that business aviation people are used to. But what are you hearing from customers? mean, are they preferring, do they want to see Starlink on the plane?

Michael Farley (03:09)

I think it's so new, I'm trying to remember the numbers that I read. think last year there was 40 installations. This year there's something like north of 600 installations going on. So it is so new. It'll be really interesting to see what the feedback is. I know that they are signing major announcements with the commercial airlines, which we know GoGo exited a year or two ago, that space to focus on the private industry.

I think it'd be really interesting to see how Starlink performs at scale. To your point, do they have, I know I use Starlink here at home and everything is app and tech and less white glove and white touch, but they're so clearly, there's so many things here that I think GoGo's gonna have to focus on, the satellite count, the coverage, right? Satellites for Starlink is up near the 6,000 satellite mark, which is global coverage, right? You can be...

Jessie Naor (03:47)

Great.

Michael Farley (04:02)

Polar, you can be outside of North America, you've got great coverage. Whereas, you know, with their partnership with OneWeb, I think they're closer to 600 satellites, right? So there's some really big things that they have to focus on and it's great to see the innovation. You know, don't want to be a Dell, right, from like the early 2000s where this massive innovation comes in. you know, it'd be really interesting to see. Clients and installations, we haven't seen many of them yet, but I think it's coming.

Jessie Naor (04:23)

Right.

Yeah.

Michael Farley (04:32)

Um, and, and I think there's, you know, the transactions seem to be holding strong in the marketplace. Um, so one other thing I would say, Jessie is that when you start to look at the installation costs, right. And the, and the business model as a whole, that's going to be a challenge for GoGo. If you're an aircraft owner, I haven't seen too many to install bills for the hardware and the, and the full build out. My understanding is, is, is that Starlink is a fraction of the cost, right? The

install 25,000, I think is what I've heard.

Jessie Naor (05:01)

Wow,

Michael Farley (05:02)

As opposed to, I'm sure you've seen a GoGo, right? It's a hundred, 75 to 150 grand or more. Yeah.

Jessie Naor (05:03)

yeah. 150, yeah, yeah.

Michael Farley (05:10)

So, and then you get the all you can eat buffet subscription model with Starlink on a monthly basis. it's...

Jessie Naor (05:16)

Yeah, or pick and

choose, you know, like they've got all these different kind of services and options. So, hey, you know, at the end of the day, though, it's going to be great for the business aviation customer because it's more competition, more options. But yeah, we'll have to see how this all pans out.

Michael Farley (05:30)

That is true. That is true.

Jessie Naor (05:31)

Well, I'm looking forward to it and I will say that I've got Starlink on my farm and on a boat and it's pretty fantastic. But I'm always open to new opportunities and options and especially if that means I get some more personalized service with it. Because I think that is the one kind of ding I give the Starlink folks. It's like if you want to reach somebody, you can't. And even if I was trying to get an extra cable one day and they were completely sold out and stocked out. Like what happens when your business jet customer is like, what do mean, Mike?

$100,000 Wi-Fi system doesn't work because you can't order a cable. I mean, those are problems.

Michael Farley (05:59)

Yeah.

It is, it's different, right? It's different than a residential user. And when you think about what the cost of private aviation is on even a per trip basis, right? And what, mean, I think we're both pretty familiar with what happens when there's no wifi on an aircraft with a client or there's expected wifi. And, you know, I get it. If you're paying that price, you want things to be right. And if you're an operator and a provider, you've got to make sure that you can...

You can have the need priority, but you have access and you can get your answer your questions answered and uptime is key.

Jessie Naor (06:33)

Yeah.

Yeah. Cool. Well, it just gave me flashbacks to my childhood. My dad was a programmer, but he was like a paper card programmer in the 90s. I remember the crazy hectic they went through to make sure that all the computers didn't crash because the nines were turning to zeros. was an interesting time.

Michael Farley (06:44)

Yeah.

Yeah.

I agree. My father was in software sales and it was the same thing, right? It's what's going to happen. And there was a lot more hardware and physical, you know, infrastructure back then. And it was like, what's going to happen? I remember it. You know, the ball's going to drop in Times Square and the lights going to go out. How's it going to be? And that's long enough ago, but close enough that, you know, you'd think you'd have some memory of that.

Jessie Naor (06:56)

Bye.

Oh, right. Yeah,

no, I don't think so. These programmers are, it's like 25 years later, it's crazy. That's what's funny too, it's the 25 year anniversary of Y2K and one of these happens. It's like, okay, come on. Someone should have taught someone about that.

Michael Farley (07:24)

Yeah.

Yeah, that is true.

Jessie Naor (07:30)

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Jessie Naor (08:24)

This is a business aviation show, but a lot of us are also involved in the medical space or deal a lot with air ambulance companies or have some relationship with them. So I want to check in on what's going on with the No Surprises Act. It came out two years ago. There's a great article in Vertical Magazine this past week that was talking about it. I think they're working through their challenges, but it's definitely still a major challenge. So it used to be...

you know, helicopter air ambulance would send the bill directly to a consumer. And now, you know, there's new laws, the No Surprises Act that has required that to go back to the insurance companies. So I think what's happening is the companies are generally getting paid for the bills, you know, when they're used properly. But one of the problems that's happening is now AR is building up because these companies are going through dispute processes and air ambulance companies aren't getting paid for 60, 90, 120 days. And I think that's

causing a lot of pressure on them. But it's such an interesting business model. mean, we have the same staffing challenges. I think it's got to be a lot harder for them. It's not only the same fight that we have with the airlines, but now you've got people that have to work for 12 hour emergency shifts. It's a tough world for them. think we've got it a little better.

Michael Farley (09:35)

Yeah, it's really interesting. I think there's a lot of steps in the right direction. Our team has really acted in a consulting capacity on this type of a situation with mostly with organ movements. And just looking at data and trying to help some biotech companies get organized. And that's extent of our engagement there. But I think the first thing is, it's really important to see that

I do agree, even as an operator in the aviation space, it is nice to see that the dialogue is moving from a provider and a patient. If you're a patient, it's obviously a critical moment in your life. It can be a tough moment and there's big bills and all sorts of things associated with that. But just see the movement of the dialogue with this act between the providers and the payees, the insurers, I think is really key.

I think when you have the payees and the providers in the same room, there's really no other way to do that. And so to your point, Jessie, I think it's certainly lumpy now.

Jessie Naor (10:26)

Okay.

Michael Farley (10:34)

It's very lumpy and I there's a mediation process there that's mandated. I've heard both sides of the coin and read both sides of the coin that even if it's in network or out of network or who's billing and how, it still seems like it's quite arduous and there's not enough mechanisms in this act that would pull the payees, the insurers forward to say, it's been 30 days. What are the terms of payment?

Jessie Naor (10:48)

Right.

Michael Farley (11:00)

Is there penalties for this payment if it's 60, 90, 120, what is it? And I think when you

start to look at the average operator, we're seeing consolidation in this space. But for a small provider, how do you manage OPEX? How do you manage payroll when you don't know when the funds are coming in? There's no mechanism to make those funds come in.

Jessie Naor (11:21)

yeah, well, I mean, look at our fuel bills alone. Imagine having to sit on fuel bills for 120 days. That's just, it's not really sustainable, especially for smaller companies, but even larger companies too. They just, can't.

Michael Farley (11:28)

Yeah.

Jessie Naor (11:33)

I can see how that's a major issue. I know there was supposed to be an advisory board put together. They've really been delayed in putting that together, but they're working on it. The other issue with this is too, it's like, and I don't know how, I think European countries handle this differently, but there are other times in which, know, patients don't need to be transported, that these services are still essential.

During COVID, when emergency rooms were overwhelmed, they were flying people in on Medevac aircraft to get more nurses, to get more doctors in those buildings. But unfortunately, Medicare is not gonna pay for any of that. Who do you bill in those cases? And that's the sticky part that I think, like you said, when we're looking at this act and the mechanisms involved, someone needs to think a little more holistically. How do you keep these companies in business?

not to mention the receivables that are piling up, but also there's certain missions and certain fixed costs that who's going to cover that? And I don't think we've answered that question yet.

Michael Farley (12:28)

Yeah, I mean, it's critical care. It's mission critical flying, right? I mean, the outcomes and the data of what these doctors and nurses are doing is, it's absolutely there. It's a service that's needed if you don't live in a major metropolitan area, if you're away from home. I mean, there's no doubt that this is a valuable service that between the government and the private side need to figure out how are going to get there? Personally, it's not all that traumatic, but I...

Two summers ago, we were out in Colorado in a more rural area. And my daughter was six months at the time and she had RSV and we were at high altitude and oxygen in the seventies. And so we had to get to lower altitude and get to Montrose. it was really interesting. And it was just, it was the decision, do you fly and med back to Denver and get to somewhere major? Because are they equipped in that region?

Jessie Naor (13:11)

Mm-hmm.

Right.

Michael Farley (13:20)

And you're kind of seeing

what are the resources here? What are they set to fix? Well, can they do? But I will say that after, even with my wife being a nurse, when we're sitting in that hospital, there was nobody that could get an IV into my six month old daughter. And I remain grateful. At one point they asked, hey, would your wife feel comfortable putting an IV into your daughter? Which she's done thousands of times, not on her own child.

Jessie Naor (13:42)

Right.

Michael Farley (13:45)

But what was really interesting was that there was a med flight team that happened to be in there in the area. And those were the people that

provided the IV. And we averted from going to Denver and were able to get the IV in a couple of days later, but it was those folks that are well-trained and did a good job. So yeah, I think it's critical care for sure.

Jessie Naor (14:02)

Yeah.

Well, you must have been very thankful that day to have your wife. my gosh, I can't imagine the stress. But those are the situations that I don't think most of us deal with, especially when you're on the East Coast or you're in an area that's got great hospital services. It's these rural locations that really need these services and it's more than just patient transport. There's other things that need to get paid for to save lives.

Michael Farley (14:11)

Yeah. Yeah.

Jessie Naor (14:31)

I guess we'll see where it ends, but I know smaller companies right now are still feeling the squeeze a lot, and I think we're gonna continue to see a lot more consolidation as we already have in that space because there's just, it's hard to compete. That's a very tough business still today.

Michael Farley (14:45)

One area that I'm not as familiar with, I wonder is, is there really opportunity there as well, In terms of, beyond the consolidation, even just for the administrative and quantification of cost and how to get smarter. Is that a tech advancement? Is that opportunity in the space to say, operationally, how do you do it better? Forget the government and what's going on there, but is there opportunity because it's

Jessie Naor (14:57)

Thank

Yeah.

Michael Farley (15:12)

probably not going anywhere. It needs to get better. Is that a platform? Is that something that helps you really look at costs and understand what services should be and adds transparency and ease and less friction between the parties to get to a very fair number, revenue number.

Jessie Naor (15:27)

Well, and especially as you know, these boards come together and come up with new rules, I'm sure there will be lots of people trying to reinvent the wheel and make it make a better way of doing that business, which is a very tough business, but.

Michael Farley (15:37)

Yeah.

Jessie Naor (15:39)

Yeah. All right. Well, so speaking of tough things, think many people are excited about the incoming presidential inauguration, obviously. I mean, that's split 50-50 depending on how you voted. But if nothing else, everyone does need to be aware that the South Florida delays are coming back. It's going to be another four years of Trump in and out of Mar-a-Lago and Washington, D.C.

and we all remember what happened four years ago when that was the case. There is gonna be an informational meeting for anyone listening at Palm Beach International Airport on January 16th next week, limited to two representatives per operator. But I think if you're in the Florida area, Michael, know you guys are, that's probably a good meeting to go get the skinny on how this is gonna go and maybe find better ways to handle it than we had four years ago.

Michael Farley (16:25)

You know, at least it's the second run, right? And it's not the first time around. We hope we learn some lessons and everybody got some practice runs. You know, sitting in Naples, Florida, I did look at the presentation that the FAA put out and obviously the TFR, we'll be okay here on the West Coast. But for those, the operators and providers, and of course we fly in and out of the East Coast very often, as most of our industry does. And just being smart and getting smart on that is interesting.

I had the opportunity to work on the 2016 campaigns. we were doing 737 movements and this is publicly available knowledge, but both sides of the aisle. And I think it was really interesting to see, because at a certain point in the campaigns, secret services

is involved, right? The forward cabin is probably 20 or 30 members of the principal and the teams and the middle cabin is secret service and the...

Jessie Naor (17:08)

So.

Wow.

Michael Farley (17:15)

the back of the plane being reserved for all the national media correspondents. And it's certainly high pressure. It's certainly very detailed. I found it very exciting, right? I think it was something like 260 plus flights in a two and half month period. Yeah. And so I think for all parties involved and

even those that have to execute all of those movements, I have a ton of respect for everything that goes into all sides.

It'll be really interesting to see how this goes down, but as we said, at least it's the second go of things here. So we had at least one dry run.

Jessie Naor (17:47)

Yeah.

Now, and for those who weren't booking flights to South Florida during that time,

Make sure you're planning extra fuel because you might end up with some crazy rooting offshore. I mean, I just it was was kind of unpredictable. Like you knew they were coming, but you never knew how bad the rerouting was going to be. Where are you going to end up? It looks like the inner core of the TFR will be around Palm Beach and Palm Beach County Park Airport. So those are going to be the worst impacts. Talk to your customers.

Maybe FLL is a better choice, FXE, something else, but Palm Beach during the TFR is going to be a tough one to get into.

Michael Farley (18:26)

I don't think those NOTAMs pop up before 72 hours, right? It's short notice. I think that the runways when the VIP arrives is there's a five or seven minute quiet period and that's about it, right? So when is it, where is it? If you have a pickleball match or happy hour to get to, you know, plan accordingly.

Jessie Naor (18:30)

Mm-hmm.

Right. And maybe, you know, plan for a car service because it's maybe not going to work out like you expect it to. So, but we'll see. Hey, it's still good. I'm really glad that we're going to have a president that is such a fan of business aviation. I hope it leads to some good things for us. But obviously, he's one of those people who sees the utility of private jets and loves to brand his aircraft. And I think at least at least that's cool. I hope that works out politically for us.

Michael Farley (19:10)

That'll

be interesting. And you know how that seeps into other parts of what we do, tax and depreciation. And it'll be really interesting to see how things progress. I'm excited to see it,

Jessie Naor (19:21)

Sure,

for sure. All right, well, speaking of Palm Beach, there was an aircraft that diverted there this week, and this is a really crazy story. A G550 hit an unidentified metal object at 27,000 feet, know, Class A airspace. There was no transponder. know, first they reports that maybe it was a bird strike, but then actually it was Sam Graves. What is his name? Ryan, Ryan, okay.

Michael Farley (19:46)

Ryan Groves. Yeah.

Jessie Naor (19:48)

So

Ryan Graves, who is the same guy who was the fighter pilot who's been doing all this work with the drones in the Northeast and he's concerned about potentially unidentified flying objects, whether that's alien related or a foreign drone related, he's very concerned about this. Obviously something up that high altitude, it's not a hobby drone. They don't know what it is. What is doing damage to aircraft at that altitude? we had no way of knowing what it is, why it hit it.

This is a little scary for an aircraft of that size too.

Michael Farley (20:19)

It definitely is. mean, I think it's interesting that the whistleblower is probably looking for some likes and clicks and get the hysteria going a little bit more despite the fact that we're not in New Jersey with this one, my home state of New Jersey. But yeah, it is really interesting that it's unidentified. It's at that altitude. I think it's been classified as an incident. It'd be very interesting, I think, if it was qualified as an accident, right, to get the NTSB involvement and get some more thorough analysis.

Jessie Naor (20:26)

Sure.

Mm-hmm.

Michael Farley (20:45)

It's not like a wrench was sitting on the wing at 27,000 feet. I think a lot of it, there's a lot of hysteria at the moment about these flying objects and what are they really. so it'll be really interesting to see if there's any more attention that we pay to it. But who knows, maybe it aliens. Maybe they're finally here.

Jessie Naor (20:55)

In.

Yeah.

Maybe they are or Chinese spy balloons or something. don't know. I find it concerning that it was classified as an incident. Well, I think some of this is probably to just the procedures of NTSB. Like if they don't have a defined amount of damage, they may classify it as an incident now and later it's an accident. But I would think metal damage inside of a turbofan engine is going to be an accident in terms of how much damage was done to it unless, you know.

I don't know, but this is, I guess we'll pay attention to it. But Graves is concerned. He's the head of the Aviation Safety for America Foundation. I don't know. I just, we'll have to see.

Michael Farley (21:41)

which I think it's, what qualifies as an accident, Jesse, the 25,000, I think is the number of the dollar amount.

Jessie Naor (21:46)

Run five

or 50 something in that range up. Yeah, and you have to imagine damage to an engine. I mean, that's going to immediately put you into a high category.

Michael Farley (21:55)

Yeah, it's not a Rotax pusher propeller, 100 horsepower engine. It's a G550. It's gonna be, I think anything costs 50,000 on that. hopefully we just get more insight and we remove some of the questions everybody has.

Jessie Naor (22:07)

Yeah, this is a it's a big question mark, but it wasn't in New Jersey, so it can't be a drone.

Michael Farley (22:12)

It's definitely not

a drill. My son just doesn't go that high, don't think.

Jessie Naor (22:16)

All right, well, speaking of just weird things, I don't know what's going on in South Florida. This is like an episode all about like our, you know, lovely state of Florida, but this week in Fort Lauderdale as well, there were two bodies found in the landing gear compartment of a JetBlue aircraft. It had recently done a flight from New York to Fort Lauderdale, but before that it was in Kingston, Jamaica, Salt Lake City, Utah. So it had been...

around for quite a while. don't really know how people got on the aircraft, when it happened. But it is concerning. This is actually something that happens a couple times a year, which I didn't realize. But how do think these people are getting on these airplanes?

Michael Farley (22:55)

You know, it's, mean, first of all, it's sad in all situations, no matter what it is, right? If it's a loss of life, yeah, that's tough, and it's sad. the routing, the original routing was kind of bizarre because it's US to US, you know, and not that the, you know, the fact that it was in Jamaica or perhaps abroad, and it makes it a little bit more interesting. But there's certainly questions, right? When you start to look at infrastructure and infrastructure security,

Jessie Naor (22:59)

Yeah.

Michael Farley (23:24)

I had the opportunity to work for a defense contractor in the mid 2000s. And there was a new initiative called the Cargo Shipping Initiative that came after 9-11. And it was about the vulnerabilities of airports. And I'm trying to remember back to some of the statistics, but at that time, right, as we all know, a commercial airliner will take our luggage and our suitcases, but the belly is also full of cargo as well, or maybe.

Jessie Naor (23:49)

Mm

Michael Farley (23:52)

Back at that time, some of the questions were, we would sit there and say, okay, post 9-11, your luggage goes on, something like 98 % of what all the passengers are bringing is scanned and is accounted for. However, the statistic for whatever was cargo was something like three to 5 % of that cargo was being scanned or had any sort of regulation on it, right? From the infrastructure to mass,

Jessie Naor (23:54)

Well.

Michael Farley (24:21)

You know, we're looking at different types of infrastructure tools

to look at the cargo pallets and everything coming in. But at that time, hence the cargo shipping initiative was to say, how do we get smarter? And instead of 3 % of the cargo threshold being scanned, it has to be more secure than that. I think there's been leaps and bounds since that time. And of course, the scanning has improved, technology has improved, but where's the vulnerability in the infrastructure, right? There's also cases of

Jessie Naor (24:36)

Yeah.

Michael Farley (24:49)

recently of passengers getting on to aircraft that don't have tickets.

Jessie Naor (24:53)

Right, the lady who went to the lavatory and just sat in there until the plane took off. How is this happening? Especially after 9-11, we really locked down our security. Maybe it's just been too long. Maybe we've kind of...

lost that situational awareness and urgency, but we're having a lot of security incidents and they're specifically involving airfields and airfield security. Even in private aviation, these eco protesters jumping onto airfields and spraying planes, just don't know. Invest in fencing, AI camera technology, what are we doing? I think that's an area that the new administration may not...

want to spend more money, but I think we need to be putting something into security of these airfields because we're having so many incidents.

Michael Farley (25:40)

You know, it's tough because I really respect what those activists have to say and what they're doing, but that just, doesn't, I don't know that that's a productive forum or format or way to do it, right? There's an intent to inflict damage and monetary and whatever else, it really, I do think that needs to be addressed and infrastructure for an airport needs to be addressed because that has unintended consequences, right? There's more fuel burn.

Jessie Naor (25:45)

Thanks.

Thank

.

Michael Farley (26:06)

Right. Because

all the planes start circling. What if there's a med, we were just talking about the med back flights, right? It's all of those things, you know, and there are better ways to engage in that type of dialogue for all the parties involved. you know, for all of those reasons, I think it's, you they absolutely should invest in more security and some of those technologies you mentioned. If I knew that they weren't scanning the bathroom, you know, it's getting expensive to fly north. I'll get my family a five and we'll...

Jessie Naor (26:15)

Okay.

Michael Farley (26:33)

We'll run down the jet blue to get into the bathroom, all five of us, and see if we

can make it off.

Jessie Naor (26:40)

Well, I'd

say it's a good argument for flying private because you got five people trying to get to South Florida. I mean, just a ticket on Southwest cost you $500 each way these days. So why not book the light or the mid? You know, it's you only live once.

Michael Farley (26:54)

Exactly. Fly direct, get the strollers on, whatever you need. Avoid the TFRs the best you can.

Jessie Naor (26:58)

And be done.

Yeah, well, that's again. Palm Beach. I think just avoid Palm Beach and be prepared for least another 20 to 30 minutes depending on your rooting. We'll see.

Michael Farley (27:09)

Jesse,

we can't tell people about the secret we have going on over here in Naples. It's beautiful over here. can't let everybody know about the secret we've got going over here.

Jessie Naor (27:17)

Naples

is exploding too. I mean, in terms of aviation, I know that airfield is always under a lot of scrutiny from the neighborhood, but it's going to keep growing.

Michael Farley (27:26)

Yeah.

It

is. It's a busy airport. think it's in the top 15 for GA and 135 and 91. But yeah, there's a lot of discussion about an airport that's been here longer than almost all the residents. But I think it also serves a crucial community and is located in pretty strategic spot. So it'll be interesting. Also, Florida is definitely on the news quite often here.

Jessie Naor (27:46)

Yeah.

Well, it's just exploding down here. I thought it was just kind of the post-COVID thing and eventually it would slow down, but it doesn't seem like it's happening. I mean, I'm seeing more and more people come here, a lot of wealth too. So the business aviation industry is just doing incredibly well in South Florida and Florida is welcoming it. It's a very business-friendly state and we like it that way.

Michael Farley (28:08)

Yeah.

Yeah,

it's, we've enjoyed our time here. We became, came pre COVID here in Naples. There's, there's eight high schools, 28 elementary schools and just in the town, just public schools. And that demographic is coming in and with it comes the business aviation and our volume we've seen in our client base coming down here, both coasts, but it has been interesting since COVID times for sure. No slow down.

Jessie Naor (28:38)

Yeah, cool.

That's good stuff. That's what we want in 2025, more growth. All right. Well, with that, we're gonna wrap up the pod today. We like to keep everything short and sweet so you can just get what you need to know on your morning commute. This is the fastest way to get your top news in aviation, what's going on in our industry specifically, but don't forget to subscribe to our weekly email digest. Let us know if you have any comments and suggestions on what we should cover next, and we'll look for you next time on the VIP